Hello everyone,
In the phone conversation this morning, there were several comments typed in the chat area that I did not address. I will list them here, with some quick comments (in italics):
Jeanette Koke: Is knowing beyond description?
Tina Countryman: aren’t we just coming up with new words to express the same thing?
We spoke about these questions during the phone call
Lois Silverstein: this is true in relationships too, alas.
Lois refers here to the idea that we lose contact with the immediate experience, which for us is what counts as the reality of the situation. Yes, our whole life is a kind of struggle to stay with immediacy, with “child-like innocence” (See below)
Lois Silverstein: isn’t this also what Plato is doing too?
I said that Socrates only asked questions, encouraging people to go beyond what they knew to be so. Plato is often described as having turned his back on this insight of his teacher Socrates, because he wanted to impose his own understanding of what is so. In any case, he does seem to insist that things can only ‘be’ in one way.
Tina Countryman: you said something last week that we don’t want to experience things as children, but is there not a childlike aspect of innocence in experiencing the aliveness of time?
See above.
Lois Silverstein: kind of a ???
Remco Wernert: if you say: cut off, then what is it cut of from? appreciation?
‘Appreciation’ is an interesting word, because it is open-ended. The more we can appreciate, the more we can know. Without appreciation, no knowledge. So the answer to your question is ‘yes’, but we still need to explore how we can expand our appreciation.
Lois Silverstein: okay about Plato… later
Lois Silverstein: the poets invite us into that aliveness of course… ee cummings is a good example. he breaks down models and invites you in.
Michael Gray: it’s really interesting that you say we can go beyond experience, not more deeply into experience–like it’s a barrier to cross
Yes, that is interesting.
Lois Silverstein: is it like mirrors ‘looking into mirrors’, facing each other
Tina Countryman: is it beyond perception?
I’m going to leave these last two questions for online discussion.
Jack
Hi Jack,
the record of the last call is not yet posted.
Karin
Hi Jack,
It seems the gremlins are still at it. Under “Phone calls and Orientation”, the “Week 5 Orientation” link does not respond. Clicking on it produces an “error 404” message.
Happy Valentines Day :-)
David
With my thinking and feeling I cannot “appreshiate” torture (to take an extreme exemple) – or I don´t understand appreshiation.
“Into experience” and “beyond a experience”. I think (!) they don´t rule out each other and I think about the center of a hurrican. I hope, I can “experience” the answer of this question.
Peter.
i think it has more to do with the ‘feel’ of it rather then the interpretation of it…it is a dynamic, to use Tarthang Tulku’s word, an aliveness and excitement that is known or even embodied…however, it goes far outside of the body, to include the presentation of what is given…while i have been aware of the different forms, they seem to be dancing in harmony…there is a brilliance of light and color…sound is vibrant and alive…the feel of it fills you up with it…and the body moves with meaning…